LIFE RELIGION FAMILY

a place to come and discuss in peace, things of religion, life, and families

Posts Tagged ‘contemporary’

A JUST GOVERNMENT !!

Posted by tawodi on April 21, 2012


Or…is it…. “just another”…….. government?

I watched today ( April 8 ) at about ten A.M. President Obama give a rambling barely coherent speech, of what his intended direction for this country is.

I was concerned that there was something physically wrong with him, as the speech in several places wandered, and was making no sense to me at all in places. I fully expected one of his aids to come up, interrupt him by whispering something in his ear, and then they would both leave the stage and the network would make some lame excuse that there had been an emergency requiring the President’s attention!

I am being deadly serious here…it was that jarring a performance.

This led me to think of what it is we are so in danger of losing, right now, as we dawdle in apathy and nobody seems to accept that it is US, that must move to save our country…It is US that must accept the FACT, that waiting for some creation of a cultural phenom as our savior, is the single most dangerous thing we can do as a nation of….. LAWS!

We are told, repeatedly, that governments that are just, rest assured of Gods blessing. We are told as Christians, “render unto Ceaser that which is Ceasers.”

We are told, we are to be in the world but, not OF the world.

Were we settled by people ( Puritans) who were devout and in their words engaged in, “Building a shining city on a hill.” Yes, we were.

As the Colonial society grew into what would become The United States, did the bigotry of some “Christian” sects seep into the cracks of that society? Yes it did, put plainly and simply.

For awhile it was legal to shoot Catholics in Mary’s town, later Maryland. Lord Baltimore put a stop to that foolishness!

Was it legal to shoot anyone seen coming over the border into the Massachussetts Bay colony from Rhode Island? Legal? Hell, it was required that you do so!!! Believe it or not, that law finally came off the books in the late eighties here in Ma.. 1980′s !!

These two, as well as hundreds of instances of others, are why the Constitution was framed as it was.

First, to assure the world that HUMAN RIGHTS, come from where ever you choose to, or WHAT ever you choose to consider, a higher power.NOT FROM MEN!!

It was framed to assure that this government has NO power to take them away. NONE!!

It ,the Constitution, was framed to assure that the sole existance of, THIS CONSTITUTION, is to protect them, enshrine them in such a way, that
Those who follow down the path of whatever destiny this nation has, never forget that. The constitution does not and, was not, formed to GIVE YOU ANY RIGHTS AT ALL!!!

This Constitution was framed and, this form of government, was CRAFTED, to protect your rights, provide for the common defense to do so, and to be that JUST GOVERNMENT, of that shining city on a hill.

We, all of us who pray, ask for wisdom, next time you pray for that, think and, Thank God, or whatever providence you happen to believe in, that the framers and the builders, SOMEHOW, inculcated in our people the thought that, THE JUST LAW,… agreed upon by our citizens,… is to be the ruler, in THIS country. Not whoever happens to presently shine in the cults of personality. The politically popular or the temporarily transcendant.

In the temporary passions we see all around us, as they rise and fall in seeming importance, they become a very poor substitute indeed for WISDOM.

Think of these things as you consider all of this, look into your heart and admit to yourself, that there have been and, will be times, when you yourself are dangerous in your passions and belief and, in the heights of passion are capable in the imprudent statement, or the innapropriate or even violent action that passion brings, as it suspends judgment.

Now, lets all once again, thank all those “old dead white guys” for their skill, wisdom and yes, the passion, to give us what they did….the last best hope of Mankind, That shining city on a hill.

a COMMENT:

Tawodi, you know that ain’t true. You can teach it in classes, as I did for thirty years, but there’s no truth in it. They pick the candidates they roll before us, and set up the primaries and elections, and give it all the facade that our vote means something, but does it? They slant the media the way they want us to see everything and we vote the way we’re channeled to vote – then we all go off to play our foolish games and wrap ourselves in our tedious little lives while they run the world the way they want to, at our expense – and where do “we” govern in any of this?? In reality, it’s all a facade of bullshyyt – and we except it, and pay the bill, and get mained and die in their wars – and for what?

rebuttal;  You both are right, but I side with Swremwin and here’s why.

I have not given up… my purpose here is the same as it ever was. To give honest perceptions to others to be of some service… no matter what form it may take…for others to use or discard….their choice, as it ever was.

This is all that is left to me, as I am at the end of my journey…or damned near anyway.

And you know WHAT? I REFUSE TO GIVE UP!

The street kid in me will NOT allow that! It is not through arrogance, or that I expect others to pay attention to me, that would be the height of stupidity and I am NOT stupid….but I am damned stubborn!

I REFUSE to believe we, as a people, who have lived the dream of freedom for over two hundred and thirty years, can not find among us the wherewithall to put a stop to this culture of envy that has so adroitly been crafted around us, to the detriment of everyone here! And, the ultimate destruction of this country and the spirit of it’s people!

EVERY -ONE- needs to STOP being a single issue voter..and vote FOR THE COUNTRY!

This means for instance “abortion” if the candidate is for it as a right for women, who gives a damn as long as they believe in the sanctity of the individual….and have a record of being a constitutionalist, then vote for them!

A fiscal conservative? Then vote for them, a constructionist who believes all them dead white guys and William O Douglas as well (a Black man) or Alan Keyes? (ANOTHER BLACK MAN) WELL THEN VOTE FOR THEM!

Can’t walk any more? Can’t drive any more? Then have your neighbor, your son or daughter, whoever! Go and get you an absentee ballot…THEN USE THE DAMNED THING AND VOTE!

I am sick to DEATH of hearing excuses about why nothing happens anymore.

THAT IS HOW THIS CURRENT FOOL GOT INTO OFFICE! Nobody gave enough of a damn to get off their ass!! And go frigging vote against him if nothing else!

The writing was on the wall I, you ,hell WE knew what he is and was… HE told us what he was going to do…why did we NOT stop him?

Single issue voters THAT’S WHY!! WELL!! This guy likes YELLOW jelly beans and everybody knows that isn’t right!!…. if he liked RED jelly beans well….. THEN I’d vote for him…….or some other equally juvenile, senseless…..CRAP!

So as a man, all I can hope to do is PZZZZ you off…and maybe, just MAYBE, that will get you to thinking and you will say to yourself…..AHH…XHIT old T is right, if I don’t stop this crap…… WHO WILL!

You sit in front of your puter and post here…right? Well why not go to blogs and post there! Give your opinion and support to the thousands of others who feel, and think, as you!! Spread the word….the nearest thing you will ever have to having your very own NEWSPAPER!

Now think about it and if you agree in the very least…get off your imaginary ass and DO IT! After all…. like me…. you ain’t doing anything else!

comment; Thomas Paine, a Pamphleteer from England said it all. He concluded America’s well-being would be an act of God’s Providence. He was our hero then. Today, his conclusions would be laughed at and derided as the folly of an affected mind – right? And we wonder why we are a nation in decline – –

This preceded the recital of Thomas Paine’s  ” These are the times that try men’s souls”…   speech.

REBUTTAL;

YOU SIR, ARE STILL A TEACHER OF HISTORY…IT IS INDEED FROM YOUR SELF AND CONSCIENCE THAT YOU AROUSE YOURSELF TO THE HEIGHTS OF PATRIOTISM THAT EVEN AS YOU DO…YOU FAIL TO SEE.

Even as the quotes of Thomas Paine are raised in print from your hand, you fail to rise to the sound of the guns and stand your ground, not in fear, you have established yourself as too brave a man for that, but in the feeling you have nothing left to give.!

To this I say to you, lead me! Show me the way you are far better educated than I…LEAD ME so that in these my final days, I may come up with the words, yea even perhaps the DEEDS, that may inspire others to then…. LEAD others.

You quote the words of the esteemed Mr. Paine and forget that he and less than a third of the men who lived here then, STOOD and resisted the fatal apathy of fear, took heart and fought and died that we now, some two hundred and thirty five years later, may take heart again and not die but simply STAND AND SAY….ENOUGH!! IT ALL STOPS HERE…AND CAST A VOTE!

You SIR, can still be a light to others with your knowledge, your constancy, and your spirit, if you can but escape the trap of despair that you have allowed to form in your mind. As I have raised my children to believe to their betterment…IF, YOU think you CAN’T, you’re right, you CAN’T! But, if you think you CAN…. well then you just Might! And that is all the guarantee any of us ever have, to free ourselves from the trap we create in our own minds, the most vicious, most ensnaring, the most hideous of ALL, for it is we who have created it!

As for me Sir, I will stand…With you, or with out you, I WILL STAND!

COMMENT;

There were three Thomases. One doubted Christ until he touched the wounds. One crossed the sea to America to call it to awakenss, then fought as a private in its Armies. Another coined high-minded words, but turned his back to Christ and ran for his life, leaving his wife and family to fend for themselves when the Dragoons approached – –

REBUTTAL;

Hmmmmm not bad, but what about US, never mind those Thomas’s…. THEY’RE DEAD!

WE ARE ALIVE!

Well, kinda sorta…..

COMMENT;

A judge told me once that he thought military service should be mandatory, with a two year commitment. Perhaps after health care is mandatory (?) we could put that in place and better help and guide our children.

ps sounds a bit like Hitler to me, the blue-eyed blond hair children.

This from a younger person this generation;

REBUTTAL;

My generation was the last, that faced mandatory service to the country.

By caving in to the runaway intelligentsia of the sixties and seventies, we became captivated by and then inured, to the idea, that the individual need make NO contribution to this country and it’s way of life. They also stopped civics classes in the late sixties and no longer REALLY teach just WHAT civics ARE!! Other than to outline all the gimmy’s you get as a citizen. You know those “entitlements” that others earn for you? You know those freedoms that you enjoy that some sap went out and served, and in some cases….. died for! Those rights that allow you to trash a whole city and the peace and civil serenity that the citizens have worked and paid for because you think you shouldn’t HAVE TO…even for your “HIGHER EDUCATION”…THERE’S A FRIGGING LAUGH!! Talk about misleading “descriptive verbiage”…. Higher education my ASS! Look how they….USE IT!

And now you compare those people from the generation before mine and mine itself as being willing pawns of NAZI’S!!??!!

Well…sir….you may take a flying_ ****_ at a rolling doughnut!!

People like me still understand to have all that we have, you NEED to work for it. You need to sacrifice for it. You need to suffer for the fruits of your labor most times

Do you wish to know WHY?

Because then, as now, when we give these things to you, they are worth EXACTLY WHAT YOU PAID FOR THEM! To you, they have no intrinsic worth because, OTHERS, sacrificed what was necessary to accomplish the goals…we lived and died so you would not have to, We left service and worked for forty some years for you to advance to the point, where you now can slander our lives, our sacrifices, and our dreams, FOR YOU, and call us “MAYBE LIKE NAZI’S!!!

Here comes that rolling doughnut again, you may want to catch it this time………..Wanna know WHY??

Well us old farts are damned tired of listening to some body with no accomplishments of their own, belittle ours! All those toys you are playing with???? WE INVENTED THEM FOR YOU…YOU IDIOTS!! You had better damned well get over your selves and get to work and do, YOUR PART!

Now OPHIDIOPHOBIA, all of this is NOT directed at you….the “you” being, in this case, “GENERIC”

It is directed at those who do the things I mentioned with impunity…at least in their myopic eyes!

COMMENT;

A person who “claims” citizenship in the Republic without serving it first is nothing but a greasy slug. So was the thought of the time in Athens when the concept of “Republic” was invented, and so should it be now. I do believe Socrates served as a general in his youth – –

That’s why I have great respect for Thomas Paine. He was a British Subject come here to awake America to its chance at Freedom and Democracy. But he just didn’t write words, he enlisted in the American Army, though not a Citizen of the Colonies. He was offered a chance at being an Officer or NCO, but he refused both, preferring to serve in the ranks only as a “high private” – a great man . .

These are again the Times that Try Mens Souls. The problem is, too many Americans now believe they don’t have one to worry about – –

If we magically cut our government by half and our taxes by half, we might just have the money in our pockets to buy the stuff we need – ya think? That’s why I follow Conservative rather than Progressive Politicians. Progressives are always looking for new ways to creat expensive programs, build giant Bureaucracies (sp) for them, then dive into our wallets and debt to pay for them. Time to stop that completely, or end up like Greece, Spain and Italy – bankrupt!

 REBUTTAL;
WE;
Not being the possessors of true “magic”, must rely on the written word to work our magic for us…… in the minds of others.This is called entering the arena of ideas….to sway the minds of the people….it is accomplished with FACTS……NOT as some would believe, with magic!

We see every day the results of “magic” from the Lamestream Media….at least it seems sometimes like that. But, is it truely magic, or is it simply plastic banana, goodtime rock and roll, BULLXHIT!?!

We see on these threads every day the presentation of ideas that come from that “mainstream’ and they are best described when properly examined as A CROCK OF PURE, UNADULTERATED CRAP!

FROM WHENCE….The beginning post of this thread.

There are over four thousand local, county, citywide, and state, news papers across this country…..There are over two thousand six hundred cable stations, local broadcast stations, and There among them, those that are V.H.F. AND U.H.F. That are broadcast as well. This includes NONE of the public stations, or universities or college stations, that broadcast also.

In the printed and broadcast media in poll, after poll, after poll, they come up with a 93…to….96 percent liberal to conservative staff ratio…..THIS is CALLED a FACT!!

Of the cable stations, from one central broadcast facility, guess how many FOX stations there are that are considered conservative? ELEVEN, yep that’s it, eleven!

All the other affiliates such as fox 25 out of Woostershire (Wooster) Massachusetts are considered LIBERAL!

DOES IT STILL SEEM LIKE MAGIC!?!

Almost all the big city markets are treated as if they were the sole property of the liberal establishment……there again, a nasty little FACT!!

Internet blogs that are rated in the “net parlance” of readable, outstrip the liberal to the tune of 71% conservative, to 22% liberal The rest undecided.

I published, for almost five YEARS, THREE of the top rated five thousand in the world all over the world! ( Source; Verve Earth statistical rating and listing service no longer extent Since being purchased by Google)

My life, religion, Family, blog this year already has over two thousand hits and climbing and many of those hits are linked to Facebook and other linkage services across the net by ping back services, spiders, and two or three others I don’t quite understand how they work.

There are thousands of other blogs rated as good or better than mine out there. You can write into and leave cogent comments or even submit articles to, for them to publish and disseminate across the country, and the world!

This is what I meant when I said that this is the next best thing to having your very own newspaper!! It wasn’t just a throw away line!

Now do you really want to complain about NOT HAVING A VOICE AND THAT EVERYTHING IS BULLXHIT!!!

18 or so votes in Idaho a few months ago should dispel that myth! Or 535 or so votes in the Florida Panhandle can dispel the rest of those myths as well!

I will bet you any money you care to name that Al Gore doesn’t think it’s a MYTH!

Some of you guys are pretty damned smart and write pretty well too! Come in, the water’s fine! Check it OUT fellas and gals….you’re gonna be frigging AMAZED!

AND….TA…DA!!….Blogs are FREE!! go to Google or WordPress and sign up and start writing. You can have as many as you can fill, for FREE, on those two platforms alone!

I still own the domain name, Tree of The Mustard Seed Ministries, but took it down (the web page) cause right now, I need to save money. That’s why, if you have looked for it, it has been gone about four months now.

You don’t need hot links to find me, just Google my name…….. You can get to all the blogs that way.

This concludes this conversation on another site I engaged in. It  concerned being active, or simply waking the hell UP and admit you are one of the slugs, you so describe as such! Do any of you now reading this… SEE THAT?  It has become pernicious as all get out,  how many people feel disenfranchised this way. The apathy has been carefully crafted by our leaders to cause it and then…. for them to gather power to themselves to control us….. YOU AND ME !!

As always follow the MONEY and POWER……and then wake UP! Follow your heart…This is the most important election of the century now before us…DO NOT vote for your self….vote for your GRANDCHILDREN.
Be well all Rev. Bruce………………………………..Tawodi

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Secular Philosophic presentation….with refutation by Rev. Bruce for the REAL World

Posted by tawodi on April 9, 2012


Here is a further presentation of a person’s,  “personal Philosophy”  based on modern “assertiveness theory.”

There was more presented than you see here,  but I have taken the liberty of editing it to eliminate those things that took away from his “basic assertions” to show why…In my opinion, as one human to another this can be a pzzz poor way to treat people if you’re not damned careful about it!

HAPPINESS IS GETTING WHAT YOU NEED.

EVERYONE NEEDS: Liberty, peace, health, sex, mind exercise, knowledge,
personal associations, art and creativity, character and a sense of
justice, and to be assertive (to be able to say “no” without feeling
guilty).

NO ONE NEEDS ARBITRARY POWER OVER OTHER PEOPLE – but it is normal to want it.
(I have added here a couple phrases to Mortimer Adler’s definition of happiness).

Also assertive behavior is associated with happiness

The Science of Assertiveness theory — aka folk knowledge (trial and error science)

Assertive (Leadership) behavior of humans: Builds relationships

Will the long-term affects be worse than any short-term discomfort I may feel if I am assertive in the first place?

The word “NO”, may have to be repeated over and over, as in a broken record.

An angry and loud communication can be assertive if one is expressing feelings (Using the word “I”, ( I am really god damn anger at you …)

vs. HOSTILE behavior-destroys a relationship: … You dumb ass, didn’t your mother teach you to report to work on time, etc. etc. Why, didn’t you do such and such….

If someone has a habit of saying, “Why, don’t you do such and such…” we all understand this to mean “I want you” to do such and such. There seems to be some kind of a minor taboo in our culture against people saying straight up, that they want.
On the use of the word YOU:

…the use of the word “you” is assertive when a person is acting in the role of boss, parent, or leader, for example, a law enforcer, a teacher, the chair of a meeting.

“You are expected to” (follow the rules, etc) , then every time the other person comes up with excuses, sob stories, etc, repeating this phase again and again (“You are expected to” (aka using the broken record shows the other person that you are not afraid to stand your ground and they need for them to rethink their poor behavior.

But remember being skeptically silent is assertive. Meaning if I try to get the last word.. will I get punched in the nose or some other bad result.

Speaking up in a group to speak is assertive because one is taking the “psychological space” of the whole group.

Hostile behavior: A person uses sarcasm and intimidation to get what they want. One may get what they want, but destroys the relationship afterwards.
It is easy to give up the benefits of hostile behavior when I value myself enough to avoid getting agitated over minor issues and when I am imperfect and incorrect.

Non-assertive behavior: (shy behavior) doing nothing about unpleasant situations and simply try to ignore ones feelings and desires. While it may prevent conflicts with others, one probably will wind up feeling helpless, exploited, angry, and disappointed with one’s self. Being “too shy” to do something.

For example, “I am sorry to bother you.” This is an example, of how being NICE sucks us into a non-assertive down-hill fall. vs. “I want to talk to you.” “ I need your help or I need or want to talk to you.”

or “It was nice talking to you.” (when it wasn’t and you didn’t enjoy talking to them).

Basic Assertive Rights:

1. The right to act in ways that promote my dignity and self-respect as long as others’ rights are not violated in the process.
2. The right to be treated with respect.
3. The right to say no and not feel guilty.
4. The right to experience and express feelings.
5. The right to take time to slow down and think.
6. The right to change my mind.
7. The right to ask for what I want.
8. The right to do less than I are humanly capable of doing.
9. The right to ask for information.
10. The right to make mistakes.
11. The right to feel good about myself.
Must I always assert my rights?
No, I am always free to choose not to assert myself, assuming that I am also willing to take the responsibility for whatever consequences may then occur.
” I don’t have to be assertive all the time”. Or “I don’t have to be perfect.. I have a right to make mistakes.”

Source: The Assertive Option by Patricia Jakubowski and Arthur J. Lange
and NO TRESPASSING by Barker and Barker.

REBUTTAL BY REVEREND BRUCE.

In the following I included the list of his “basic assertive rights,” again,   for clarity of presentation. If you re-read the upper portion though you will see that the whole premise is shot full of holes from the git go…..At the end of the presentation I explain how and why. ENJOY!….AND AS ALWAYS……..CHOOSE WISELY……………..TAWODI.

Basic Assertive Rights:

1. The right to act in ways that promote my dignity and self-respect as long as others’ rights are not violated in the process.
2. The right to be treated with respect.
3. The right to say no and not feel guilty.
4. The right to experience and express feelings.
5. The right to take time to slow down and think.
6. The right to change my mind.
7. The right to ask for what I want.
8. The right to do less than I are humanly capable of doing.
9. The right to ask for information.
10. The right to make mistakes.
11. The right to feel good about myself.
Must I always assert my rights?
No, I am always free to choose not to assert myself, assuming that I am also willing to take the responsibility for whatever consequences may then occur.
” I don’t have to be assertive all the time”. Or “I don’t have to be perfect.. I have a right to make mistakes.”
Source: The Assertive Option by Patricia Jakubowski and Arthur J. Lange
and NO TRESPASSING by Barker and Barker.

While I find your treatise interesting it kinda falls short in several respects. As latter day Philosophical arguments are wont to do.

I must admit that most of it will stand a simple examination sort of only at the surface of it but I will outline my exceptions and give you the WHY at the end of my post.

Assertiveness training is largely a crock and here’s why.

Basic Assertive Rights:

1. The right to act in ways that promote my dignity and self-respect as long as others’ rights are not violated in the process. [Granted; Not bad on surface examination, but there are corollaries extent, for instance; who decides the “right” of the issue? ]

2. The right to be treated with respect. [ To be treated with respect in almost any surrounding isgranted by earning it Not simply because you demand it. What makes you special?]

3. The right to say no and not feel guilty. [granted; unless it comes from risk assessment to your self…. and not to others!]]

4. The right to experience and express feelings.[Granted; You should be aware though,  your assumption here…. is that anyone CARES how you feel about the issue at hand….. Sorry about that. ]

5. The right to take time to slow down and think.[ Granted;  if time permits…but remember…. it will NOT BE…. if you do not grant that same luxury to others under your charge.]

6. The right to change my mind.[ Granted;  Only someone with an ossified mind would refute this. As long as you are willing to bear the expense, and consequences, of doing so.]

7. The right to ask for what I want. [Granted]….just don’t expect to get it.

8. The right to do less than I are ( sic)…. (am)…. humanly capable of doing. [Granted;  reciprocity being an equal granting of “the right” by you…… When you are the one who is forced to make excuses for poor production performance]

9. The right to ask for information. [Granted;  one cannot proceed very well in any endeavor without accurate information……. Be ready to say you didn’t understand what you were told though.]

10. The right to make mistakes. [Granted;  Every body does…Are you ready to stand and say…. NO EXCUSE SIR!…. If so then…. Carry on!]

11. The right to feel good about myself. [Granted;  IF you deserve to! ]

Must I always assert my rights?

No, I am always free to choose not to assert myself,  assuming that I am also willing to take the responsibility for whatever consequences may then occur. [WHAT responsibility? You didn’t offer any thing to what ever develops, did you?] Ergo: cheap cop out!

” I don’t have to be assertive all the time”. [Granted;  Because that would be a little overbearing wouldn’t it?]

Or “I don’t have to be perfect”….” I have a right to make mistakes.” [Granted;…. Asked and answered.]

Sir; please understand that my issue is not with you, but, when a piece is delivered by some one else… even if attributed to them…. and then claimed as a personal philosophy,…. well then it AIN’T very damned personal then….. IS IT?

It BEGS,  literally BEGS,  to be defeated  seriatum,  ( or, in detail.)

But for modern day philosophy, being what that is….. I would rate it at about fifty per cent….. on the conscience scale.

Be well friends…………….Rev. Bruce……………………………Tawodi

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Contemporary Secular or Relativistic Morality

Posted by tawodi on April 5, 2012


This is from the Military,com forums, where I regularly contribute to the exchanges there between active service members and Veterans who participate.

When I started this thread I fully expected to meet with a storm of resistance. Well I haven’t really and those that disagree seem to be holding their fire so far, as perhaps they research their responses.

I applaud them for that, as it is, as it should be, for a discussion to proceed so as to approach a concensus. Not that there will ever really BE a concensus as too many variables exist to do so….we, none of us, myself included, can convince others we have an answer much less all the answers, to either side of the question.

Now I will proceed to perhaps the pre-eminent of those lauded by atheists and agnostics, and others, who attempt to refute the connections to humanity and the consideration of linkage between morals and conscience. Dr. Richard Dawkins.

In 2006 he published a treatise that purported to present the “scientific argument” against free will and personal responsibility.

In his treatise he surmised that mankind was strictly a product of our environmental conditions in which we were raised by our parents and the place, family framework, social structure and surrounding social environment.

Now this weighty tome was quite the read,  if you lack a brain,  because the whole thing is flawed by positing the argument that it did.  I for one,  being living proof of that flaw and so, damned near, is most of humanity in the modern world especially here in America.

Why? Well since the entire theory posits that we will be so heavily influenced by our prior experiences we are incapable of changing ourselves or our surroundings by an exercise of free will.

In point of fact this publication also went so far as to proclaim with great fanfare among the intelligentsia of the liberal elite, that free will not only didn’t exist, but that it was impossible….FOR…… IT TO EXIST!

Now when you begin to examine the flaws and failures of this modern society we live in
You MUST consider,  that the modern liberal Psychiatric community and that of the Psychological associations agree almost to a person that this is so. Beginning with good old Sigmund Freud,  Jungian theories and so many others,  if you want to know who go look it up yourself, I ’haven’t the time ! In fact Dawkins even made these following statements in this tome of intelligent comments, which I quote for your edification. Don’t thank me, too many people take this man seriously!

1. “Doesn’t a truly scientific, mechanistic view of the human nervous system make nonsense of the very idea of responsibility?”

2. Any crime, however heinous, is in principle to be blamed on antecedent conditions acting through the accused’s physiology, heredity and environment.”

3. Dawkins even made the statement that…and I quote once again, “ Isn’t the murderer or rapist just a machine with a defective part?”

Now how to put this in perspective? First you must understand I may be guilty of condensing it just a smidgeon! Trust me,  there was a whole lot more verbiage and bluster and quite frankly, bloviating,  to cover any apparent errors in judgement or need I say….reasoning?

How can I get you to grasp my meaning but by anology. You know I love them!

You are driving your car to somewhere….it breaks down…..you step from the vehicle with an iron bar and begin beating the car with it!!

This what Dawkins and others are suggesting! There is no point to punishing people for their crimes…THEY HAD NO CHOICE!! They’ve got a bad transmission…or something!

Now so you can understand further,  let us go back in time to the Menedez Brother’s trial for the double murder of their mother and father. If the memory is fuzzy I will clear it for you,  then you can remember your disbelief and rage at the verdict.

ENTER; The frizzy headed blond ( blond….?  is there a joke here?) no, unfortunately there is not. I certainly wish I could be more emphatic, but you can only do so much with italics!

She was the one hold out on the Jury, which caused the Judge to declare a mistrial. In front of the cameras she Quite emotionally stated……” I could NOT vote for conviction!” “They are ORPHANS!”

I saw it,  most of you saw it,  it was all over television for days, remember? Well I certainly do. How about the O.J. trial? There has never been a trial presented with so much clear and damning evidence presented in modern America as that one…..the verdict? Not guilty.

Do you now begin to see what happens when everybodies looking for a pass! This is the world we live in now.

Now are there humans with little or even NO…. conscience? You bet the pants hanger behind you there are!  BUT, do they get a pass to continue to prey on humanity because they’ve got “bad parts” Or do we lock them up and throw away the ROOM if we have to…. to protect others…. never MIND punishment…Or even worse….. correction.

No Prison ever corrected anyone ever! It only “educated them that if they did that or some thing worse there would be a penalty for it…WHY? Because WE as a society SAID SO…….THAT”S….. WHY!! Some things are right…. somethings are wrong….CHOOSE WISELY…….sound familiar? It should.

So…to surmise what does all this mean. Well they mean on the serious side that the denial of free will is neither scientific nor sensible. One may say with all seriousness that science is,  that science that depends on cause and effect to be understood….. as science!

The study of conscience is far more difficult, in that it consists of minutia so small, over so long a time, as to be virtually indecipherable even with a computer. We can study the squiggles on an E.E.G. chart but to decipher what they mean, except in the physical aspects of them, is impossible! We cannot read the squiggles with out the patient telling us what they were thinking! This is also irrefutable.

To suggest that conscience is from the physical is ludicrous in the extreme….Wanna know why….not even you some times know why you “did” something! So explain to me how is THAT possible if it’s all physical. And yes I know about the lizard brain…..and it’s no frigging excuse for your actions except in times of almost fatal stress and reaction!
Times of passion don’t cut it in my book I ALWAYS knew what I was doing no matter how Pzzzd I was!!  What stopped me from acting,  was the knowledge of the consequences, to me, the focus of the anger, (which isn’t always another person) or to my family. Threaten them or me physically then it didn’t matter to me, you’re going down and then we might discuss further developments! My conscience was engaged every second of the confrontation and you’d better believe I knew it! So I refuse to buy the cheap crap excuses we hear every day from these fools that have brought this upon us and insist in forcing us to swallow it .

Free will A modest scientist would immediately concede that science says nothing at all about free will as a spirituality, anymore than it can deny the existence of God.
A materialistic or mechanistic view of the universe that leaves no room for the possibility of spiritual realities, is not a scientific one at all but a philosophical one. There is nothing scientific about denying that possibility.

Now we come to the chicken or the egg part of the discussion. Which came first…conscience or free will.

Well Theologically you MUST have conscience….. to HAVE free will! That is what your conscience is…. FOR! To allow you to choose. The right from the wrong…simple ain’t it…till you use it to solve real life problems THAT presents the difficulties I mentioned before and need not be restated here. Why do you NEED to be able to choose? Well if you have no choice then you DON’T have free will do you? Again Theologically speaking The first commandment (per Jesus) IS…”Love the Lord God with all your heart, all your spirit, all your mind and all your strength”

Without free will there is no love.  There can not be with no choice in the matter. In the case of no choice why would you even need a mind! You would not, everything would be rote repetition of previous experience. I have seen all the arguments about birds build nests and yes they do and according to their species they all build them somewhat differently don’t they…..Why don’t doves all build different KINDS of nests to support that argument. Why don’t beavers build condominiums….. instead of dams with sticks and mud…yeah they’er pretty good dams….. but not much good for anything else are they? That is NOT creation of the new is it? It is rote learned repetition as that is all they are capable of.

And so it is with free will and conscience with out one there is no need of the other.

So here’s the deal folks! You can continue to live with your scientific theories as your sole form of accepting you existence….I will live with my spirituality as mine.

You can NOT prove quite a bit of what you present most times, neither can I at least to you who have never experienced the spiritual in a believable, to you, way.

Be well friends…………..Rev Bruce………………….Tawodi

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SOCRATES, PLATO, ARISTOTLE, ROUSEAU AND…. MORALTITY

Posted by tawodi on March 25, 2012


For years I, and others, have argued that morality and more importantly, Conscience, are inextricably interlinked. In these arguments we are told that secular humanism can supply the same morals that religion does….which I and others agree with….to a degree.

In really delving into the ramifications of all these arguments though, I have always felt the pieces missing to the debate and have been unable to quantify just why.

A few months ago I stumbled on something and it is this.

Why not, as is so often done, turn their arguments back upon those who do the same to us….with such telling results, in some circumstances.

I continued to consider this and came to the conclusion that I just wanted T i t for tat, and that is no argument what-so-ever. It is specious sophistry at the very best.

Sophistry…. !!WHAM!!…. Holy Hannah!! that’s IT!

Sophistry comes from the NAME, Sophocles, another great Philosopher, do the research and then refute it using their own presentations.

How to do that honestly….honesty being of paramount importance in any debate, or argument, as the logical fallacies that are perhaps introduced by yourself, will utterly defeat your own presentation.

So first, let us begin with,

SOCRATES; He posited that the knowledge of right and wrong, is what makes us accountable for our actions. conversely, he posits that moral faults are the consequence of ignorance of the “Good”.

PLATO; Also subscribed to this as well, in as much as he surmised that whoever knows the “good”…. will do it!

This is, pointedly, the projection of their own goodness onto humanity in general, and palpably, factually and provably, FALSE.

ARISTOTLE; He posited that morality could not stem from this and pointed to another analysis in his refutation their premise and and gave his own presentation of this logical fallacy.

Aristotelian Philosophy being some what more logical in presentation, and fact, does come closer to the mark, in that he posited that this was, by simple observation, wrong As those so instructed still chose to do wrong!

He surmised that there were four basic divisions of morality and they were constructed as follows. Virtuous, restrained….unrestrained and vicious….in descending order.

VIRTUOUS; Those who do good spontaneously and happily.

RESTRAINED; Those who do good, but only after much huffing and puffing, strutting and posing. In short, internal argument with their conscience.

UNRESTRAINED; These are the ones who know what they should do but give in to their passions and weakness and do wrong, with very little conscious conflict.

VICIOUS; Those who, when confronted with a choice, will do evil with absolutely no internal conflict with conscience, felt or even experienced!

His presentation of these four “groups,” broken down as it is, and then condensed to two categories, lays itself open to defeat seriatum, because any argument from the general to the specific, fails because there are ALWAYS exceptions to the general presentation. which leads to defeat seriatum…(in detail)

Now let us examine this further.

In his presentation we can see the progression of the classes with this simple example.

Your mother calls down to you and asks you to bring her, her purse. It is to be found on the kitchen counter and her wallet is beside it. You put the wallet in it and bring it to her.
VIRTUOUS; He will go and bring her the purse with no second thoughts.

RESTRAINED; He will see the wallet and know it has money in it looks inside and, the conflict begins! How much can he get away with? Any? Some? ALL!? And around, and around, he goes until finally…. he puts the money back, puts the wallet in the purse and brings it to her.

UNRESTRAINED; the same argument ocures as above BUT! He decides to take a dollar as he surmises she will never miss just a buck for Pete’s sake! obviously consumed by his weakness and passions for personal gain at whomever’s expense.

VICIOUS; Goes gets the purse,sees the wallet, empties it throws the wallet in the garbage grinder waits a moment and brings her the purse…. wallet? WHAT wallet mom? No internal conflict here! Nope, nu uh, none!

AND NOW TA DA!!; We have good old…..

ROUSEAU; He’s the one who came up with the good old “Bon Suavage”. In this treatise he posits that it is only by association in, and with, society in general we lose our sense of “goodness”

Not to put too fine a point on it, but this is self contradictory, as it belies the FACT that it is that same society that GIVES us religion and morality concepts of the day, and time, and culture we live in!! Talk about a logical fallacy!!

When Capt. Cook was EATEN in Hawaii was that the example of Le Bon Suavage?

When James Town was wiped out, OR The people on Roanoke disappeared, another example of Le Bon Suavage? Dearborn in Illinois, Another?

Well THIS could be given as the evolutionary bon sauvage but certainly NOT the religious example of conscience.

Now let us move into the area of Religious morals and secular, humanistic moral relativism.

In religious morals, some things are always good and some things are always wrong. It is in life that the application becomes difficult, as then we have to deal with realities and the consequence to others feelings, actions, reception of our choices, and the consequences to them if what we, or they, did was illegal and now they, or us, may have to face punishment.

It is important to note here, that so far, I have not used the word “sin” or “sinful”. In my mind they are, rightfully, able to be juxtaposed, one with another at any time. I don’t like to use the word “sin” as it is a “trigger word” to many and especially Atheists…or Humanists and they stop listening, or thinking, when they hear them. For which, really, they can’t be blamed. The same way the religious react when we are called, superstitious congenital idiots!

Kinda self defeating, trying to communicate with people that way… ain’t it!?

LAW…Secular Humanism and Moral Relativism ;

Secular Humanism assumes that human beings can, with no guidance from any supreme being, create laws that will guide us the same way.

They also assume that these self same “laws” will form the “New Human Conscience” for the future. They then tell us in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS THEY WILL BROOK NO OBJECTIONS TO THIS…. “TRUTH”……You can not legislate morals!!!

WHAT DID YOU JUST SAY!?!

BZZZZ…BZZZZ…..BZZZZTTT LOGICAL FALLACY… LOGICAL FALLACY…. LOGICAL FALLACY!!

If morals can not be legislated, then just what the hell are you doing????

Can you legislate a conscience? Can you legislate right and wrong feelings? Can you legislate things that are free of black and white and apply this morality where none ever have attempted to be so arrogant?? Or… been successful at before in all of human history?

In your world of “moral relativism” we know damned well what the results are! We see them every flipping day! Children murdered by their parents and others and given a pass, sometimes set free, Why? Because they, (the murderers) were found not responsible. People being murdered in our streets and those responsible are made victims, because their mom’s took away their tinker toys when they were twelve, or some other such… CRAP!

Or the ones who chop up their families with an axe and they have the excuse that they were abused! THIS is what moral relativism brings us, all this and more.

Because people are no longer struggling with their conscience…. THEY DON’T HAVE ONE!! It has been nearly legislated away….Why?…. Well ya see… it’s like this, cultural relativism teaches us that in our culture others may find our beliefs wrong…and that is so…but then we are to take into account those people in our laws and then try and craft a society from the result? GOOD LUCK! HOW’S THAT WORKIN’ FOR YA SO FAR?

O.K.  Since we have been the single most successful nation to ever grace the earth and are the ones that are always counted on to bring succor to the suffering, freedom to the oppressed, and all those other things that have been  demanded of us by the Europeans, and others, when, and where, did we become so frigging EVIL!!

I would suggest to you it began in the early sixties when the intelligentsia finally gave custody of the asylums, schools and other institutions, over to the insane…or at least the young, with skulls full of mush, who didn’t KNOW didlly squat and because they hit people in their liberal guilt, they were successful in doing so!

So inform us please, Oh Great Ones, just WHAT are we to replace a well formed fully functioning and well integrated conscience…. WITH!

Because here’s the rub…where does conscience come from? Are you going to tell me it just evolved? Well then where did it devolve.. to… in just the last thirty five years!? I mean come ON…if it evolved, then we took millions of years to do so…right? Or as we see now, some in their desparation to remove belief in some supreme being are running shows AD NAUSEUM ALL OVER TELEVISION THAT [I]ALIENS Are responsible for all our gains as human beings and our “legends of Gods”.

I see this as being more desperate than a horni sailor after closing time in a bar! You expect to bring this as your argument now!?! O.K. give it a shot….you will probably be just as successful as you have been trying to eradicate religion in the past.

Your offerings and arguments have fallen far short of the mark….just sayin’

Be well friends…..Rev. Bruce…………………………..Tawodi

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WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN….THE EVENTS IN THE MIDDLE EAST.

Posted by tawodi on February 22, 2011


Most of us have watched the events unfold over the last seven or eight weeks in the Middle East, beginning with the demonstrations in Egypt which focused most Americans in on the events and then leading to seven different countries and the protests there for “democracy”. It seems the beginning was in Tunisia,  then moved to,  briefly,  Kuwait, Jordan, then to Egypt,  Yemen,  Algeria,  Libya,   The United Arab Emirates and now even small demonstrations are being seen in Iran.

Many of us that have done work in various phases of interfaith efforts and other venues of bridge building between peoples have seen two sides to this coin. The hopeful side that wants real democracy and the other side that wants Sharia law installed in a government that perforce becomes a theocracy,  which could mean another Iran.

Of course there will be differences all through the mix as well. The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt is repeatedly sited as a moderating force, but they were NOT the ones who started the demonstrations in Egypt and are relative late comers to the show. But because they have an organised structure it may be easy for them to rise to the top of negotiations and setting up whatever government is to follow.

Supposedly they call themselves moderates, and have at least spoken that way.  But,  the other branches of the Brotherhood,  in other countries,  are not moderate and have elemants of Hamas and Hizbollah and others that are downright terrorist organizations. That naturally concerns people everywhere. Especially in the western world.  And of course Israel.

In Egypt there have been very heartening examples of the people giving succor and support one to another regardless of religion or politics and that is a great hope lifter. In many instances they have shouted,  ” Christian or Muslim, we  are EGYPTIANS FIRST!  This brings great hope that the people’s will to enter the twenty first century alongside the western secular governments that assure freedom of what ever someone believes, and that it can be practiced in safety and security. I myself believe that is the hope of most people no matter where they live or in what country they reside.

With freedom comes responsibility to one another,  as few realise who have never had true freedom before,  but it is a hard learned lesson that has been brought to the people as an example in Iraq and Afghanistan.  Hard won indeed as so many want to hold power over those who are different and subjugate them anew.

It is my fondest wish that we will see the honest brokering with the people and their militaries and current and future leaders for shared power and responsibility in the countries as they shake off the bonds of Monarchies and dictatorships that have endured for,  in some cases,  1400 years!

Let us all pray for these people and the countries they live in that they can find peace,  liberty, and true equality in these perilous times.

Rev. Bruce Holzrichter Sr.  Pastor,  Tree of The Mustard Seed Ministries  and  Co-founder..The People of Abraham,  Christians,  Muslims and Jews.

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It is TIME The People of Abraham Christians,Muslims and Jews.

Posted by tawodi on February 8, 2011


logo

With all the changes occuring in the world around us, the time has come to begin a membership drive for The People of Abraham, Christians, Muslims and Jews.
The group was begun in 2007 with the goal of bringing people together to discuss and form ways of accepting one another not as people of different beliefs who could not co-exist together, but as religious people who worshipped God understanding that God has a name and to some He is God, to others He is I AM, yet to others still, He is ALLAH, the one God.

It is with this in mind that many have come to read and learn from our example. The principle of mutual respect has grown in many instances into one of genuine love for people who are different but still are people with all the same goals that HUMANS have.

The first is to live free to worship in their own way. The second is to be safe in their persons and families. The third is to be accepted as our fellow citizens of the United States and the world, and not some nefarious OTHER to be afraid of, to see in suspicion or as a threat to the status quo.

Most of these people, be they Muslim, Christian, or Jew, simply want to be left alone to live and prosper. Raise their families, educate their children and pass peacefully into a future secure in these same ways, for those children.

Many of our friends have seen my writing and that of Robert Salaam the other co-founder of The People of Abraham and see what we have attempted and are accomplishing on a fairly small scale.

With this history I have contacted several friends who are members and asked them point blank, “Is it time to ask all of our friends and acquaintences into the fold?” Or will many of them be put off because I am a Christian Minister and be suspicious of that, and me, to ask this way. In each and every case they assured me I would be accepted because of my track record and that one of the best things EVER would be to swell the ranks of The People of Abraham to meet and deal with the changes occuring around us in the world today.

To provide a voice with a track record of what we believe, and practice, and to show that it does WORK! In spite of all the warnings and fear we have encountered…. IT DOES WORK!

I am posting this today, Tuesday February 8th. on the Blog for T.P.O.A. at http://peopleofabraham.blogspot.com **** My blog; Life religion family at…https://tawodi.wordpress.com **** And the face book location of T.P.O.A.

I am also going to take the risk of asking all of our members to send a message to all of their friends on their lists for them to do the same. Join us and swell the ranks of T.P.O.A. as membership increases, we can be a stronger voice for peace and interfaith relations around the world. There are organizations with whom we are linked around the world now, for a short time our blog was rated one of the top five thousand in the world! I want that again… and more!

Those who do join us, need not fear they will be dragooned into doing anything they don’t agree with, or of taking controversial stances for one faction or another, simply work for, and wish for, peace for all human beings everywhere and the right to live in that state of peace. There are among us people who write for a living and lecture on many things that support our goals such as uplifting the Ahmadiyya sect of Islam and the Sufi’s as well. Both peace ful and very able to co-exist in the secular world today. That of course does NOT exclude Shiite and Sunni many of whom are American citizens and have been for generations! I do NOT give a pass to sects of Chrisrtianity that are not tolerant of other belief systems and faiths, if they spew hate they are called out for it! I myself really need not worry about my reputation, it is all over the net what, and who, I am and what I believe, and work for.

So join us! You will find the group at the face book location and signing up is easy and absolutely free anything you do to help us grow. Even just adding your name to those of us who pray for peaceful co-existence will be welcome indeed!!

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From Memorial Day

Posted by tawodi on May 30, 2009


The point is…once again….that your rights don’t come from MEN or GOVERNMENTS!!

If they did, the constitution wouldn’t be worth a tinker’s damn!!

The words of the Declaration of independance and the Constitution, are what created the dream in men’s minds that YOU are now living!!

That is all it is people, a dream!! That’s how truly fragile it really is!! It is a chimera, a wil-o-the wisp, A phantasm, sprung directly from the hearts of dreamers from over two centuries ago, that they formed into a living presence and a dream that millions have lived. And, they did so, without truly knowing what it was or how it was attained, but living it none the less.

A chimera, that some few among us all, even today, are willing to give their lives for, even though they couldn’t really explain it to you either!!

From time out of mind, from even before the dawn of civilization, men and women have felt it, lived for it, trained their children to covet and treasure it, even though they couldn’t explain it, or where it came from then, or where it comes from now.

Some shouted it as they died, some whispered it as their lives fled from them in rivulets across the ground, of some far away battlefield, they couldn’t even pronounce the name of properly.

Some have pursued it through swamps real and imagined, across deserts that stretched beyond their endurance, just as the hunger for it outlived them.

Some have provided it for us without knowing they did so, simply by being productive citizens and paying the taxes levied for the joint defense of us all.

Some have preserved it, dying in prisons of the unjust and by being remembered for their courage and inspiring us to ever greater efforts toward it’s preservation.

Some have conveyed with a glance, all of it’s meaning and some, with millions of words, have failed to convey even a glimmer of what it truly IS.

It is a word, a thought, a deed, a hope, a wish, a memory for some, for others a future untold.

But at the end of each day…still a dream, still a chimera, still a will-o-the wisp, unfathomable, unexplainable, unearned, loved and cherished, even to foolishness, but NEVER to be surrendered. NEVER to be given up and never, never to be thrown away!

The name of the dream?? One word…..freedom.

The place where it was truly given life in the minds and hearts of men?

The United States of America.

And for at least a while, as it is cast aside by the many for security in the foolish hope that a man can preserve it alone for us, with the hollow promises of a politician, the last best hope for the world, the same, The United States of America.

The land of dreamers….may we be preserved as such…….

Dedi cated to our troops and those who wonder at our nation.
Be well friends………..Rev. Bruce……………………….Tawodi

 

 
 

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How much more of this poison do we need to hear??

Posted by tawodi on May 12, 2009


The following is from Christians United For Israel’s blog and news letter, which I receive weekly I thought it time to bring some of this here so you can see what you may not be aware of, that is in the world.

Mind you this was at a meeting of held under U.N. auspices.   Is it time for some hard thinking vis a vis our relations with them and others??

Rev. Bruce

Author David Broder from his blog;

Last week, the day before Holocaust Remembrance Day, Iran’s President Ahmadinejad addressed the United Nations anti-racism conference in Geneva.  Here, he did a great favor for all who love Israel — he was honest.  He allowed his virulent hate for Israel and his bizarre anti-Semitic conspiracy theories to flow from his tongue largely unfiltered.  It was an ugly performance. 
 
The delegates from most European nations walked out on Ahmadinejad’s speech.  Even the UN Secretary General, Ban Ki-moon, was moved to criticism.  Most other delegates, of course, remained in their seats.  Many cheered. 
 
But Ahmadinejad is rarely so honest.  And he is rarely so helpful.  It is what this man does in the shadows — not what he says in public — that is most dangerous.  And what he does in the dark typically gets far less attention.    
 
In a little-noted development last week, the Israeli newspaper Haaretz, citing an Egyptian source, reported that unidentified warships torpedoed an Iranian cargo ship off the coast of Sudan.  The Iranian ship was reported to be laden with weapons bound for the Gaza Strip.  The warship is believed to have been Israeli
 
In January, there were numerous reports that unidentified warplanes attacked a convoy of trucks passing through the Sudanese desert.  The trucks were reported to be filled with Iranian arms bound for Gaza.  Well-placed sources have confirmed that the planes belonged to Israel.   

Israeli observers believe that this arms convoy contained Iranian Fajr rockets.  Such rockets — with a range of 70 kilometers — would give Hamas the ability to strike the heart of Tel Aviv. 
 
Looming large behind all of these efforts against Israel, of course, is Iran’s nuclear program.  Iran continues to enrich uranium in contravention of United Nations resolutions.  In February, United Nations officials acknowledged that Iran now has enough enriched uranium for an atomic weapon. 
 
Which leads us to one final news item from last week.  In hearings before Congress, Secretary of State Hilary Clinton warned that the US is laying the groundwork for “crippling sanctions” against Iran if diplomacy fails to stop its nuclear program.  This is a certainly a positive development.  Offering Mr. Ahmadinejad carrots without a stick in sight was unlikely to elicit much of a response. 
 
The Iranian threat is not going away.  And walking out on Ahmadinejad’s speeches — while important and deeply appreciated — does nothing to stop his steady, daily, determined actions to confront Israel.  Offering negotiations — while quite possibly a good way to build greater international support — must not be allowed to turn into yet another opportunity for Ahmadinejad to delay and stall.  It is time for the world to graduate from gestures to actions. 
 
Iran has proven itself able to talk and act at the same time.  The Israelis, too, are acting with constant vigilance to keep Iran from arming its proxies on Israel’s border.  There is no reason why we should not act as well.  There is indeed a time for “crippling sanctions” against Iran.  That time is now.  

 These are dangerousd times and we ALL of us owe Mr David Broder and Reverend Hagee our thanks for bringing these things to our attention when so many will not, especially our main stream media.

Rev. Bruce Holzrichter Sr……………………….Tawodi

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A conversation in progress with a Chaplain friend

Posted by tawodi on April 2, 2009


I made a post on another forum and thought it might make for interesting reading here;  The beginning premise of the questions are,   prevenient grace from God.

O.K.

The accusation of not being able to be objective wears a little thin with me and here’s why. For most of my life you could have called me an agnostic at best.

I studied, compared, analysed, debated, argued, fussed, fumed and finally said, the hell with it all, at about the age of thirty two.

Then came Jan 8th 1983….ah crap!!! talked to my counsellor I was seeing at the time, told him what happened and finally said to myself, O.K. fool, now you know what a nervous breakdown feels like!! And got on with it….that’s the way I am, for a whole host of reasons, quit B***chin and GET ON WITH IT!!!

I Kept reading though, checkin’ things out, still wouldn’t fully commit to ministry, though I did attend church sporadically from 1991 on and did work as a lay speaker and things.

2002 June, Bang!!! Slam!!! Dunk!!! Alright why me, and moreover, why NOT me?? Started REALLY checking things out and found out something….there have been literally hundreds of times when things that I did, made no sense what-so-ever for the person I was at the time, but they all each and every one of them turned out good and sometimes with totally unforseen outcomes that were NEVER seen that way before by me till I sought the answers.

And man, did I get some flipping answers!!!

Now, I don’t ask a single person to accept, or believe, the reality that I have found, because they have to find it on their own….but it is real, it is proven, and I live it every day and will till I die!!

AND!!! It was REASON that brought me here!!

So make of it what you will, I will not argue it, I will not defend it, it needs no defense, I’m not selling it to you, if you want it, it’s free!! Take it or leave it…your choice…..

Choose wisely….T

And, immediately followed that with this for others who participated.

Alright fellas I needed to say the forgoing first, because there’s more!!

The above is about me, and me alone. Others have had similar experiences and feel as I do. Some are not as erudite as I, so be it. Some are much more so….so be it.

There are others though, that have NOT done the work I and others have done. They listen to others tell them things and parrot those things as gospel and fall into large dark places and bring others with them. I don’t argue that point with you, or anybody else, because it is true.

Extremeism is ugly, destructive and deadly, as we all know and it is destructive in ways that are not violent but destroy the person, not the place, on personal levels not seen with the eye, in families, in society and in the world in general.

All of you also know I’m not afraid to call a spade a spade and point out along with you, those times when it needs doing, and I do more than just point fingers, as you all know as well.

But to stop the destruction, stop the violence, and stop the devision, you guys of no religious systems and I, are in my mind, allies and brothers in arms, as we once were, for real, in the world. I take pride in seeking justice with you in those times when it is hard to find, or simply overlooked because of biases that some possess and can not see beyond.

So, stick that in your hooka and smoke it!!

Angel/Devil T

And then my friend asked the following question;

Bruce…

Did you ever wonder why we only see the real prevenience when looking back. Sometimes over many years and in many situations, but always when looking back. Just some thoughts…
Be well…
CJ

And, the answer was………

Yeah C.J., I have wondered that, and don’t any longer.

What has to transpire, is the loss of surity of, “self”.

Some thing, or series of some things, must occur to rattle you down to your very core and force you to ask questions of your self, that are too frightening to ask under normal circumstances, or the need simply never arises within you to ask them.

That something does NOT have to be life threatening, destructive, or simply uncomfortable. It must motivate you, to do the work, to see who you REALLY are though.

You must be willing to stand naked in front of the mirror of your mind, SEEING the scars and how you got them, the pimples, the warts, ALL of it, and take each answer as it comes, honestly, no matter how disparageing to your self image it may be, no matter how painful the truth is, and incorporating it into who, and WHAT, you truly are.

I have learned, that very damned few of us will do that.

I learned it by the time I was twenty, I never could stand the illusions that people try to foist off on me, and could not stand excuse making on my part either. This has caused untold misery for me in my life, because if you have no illusions about yourself, others see that, and they understand that you will not tolerate theirs, about themselves. This is enemy making 101 in the social hierarchy that we have created in the world today. Perhaps it always was, I don’t know.

I mostly kept to myself, even when participating in so many different things, throughout my life.

The short answer to your question is, we always credit ourselves with too much, when citing our accomplishments, forgetting family, friends, co-workers, and too many others, that are forgotten along the way, that we learned from, took advantage of, or simply observed and copied, to achieve whatever it was, we have achieved.

Never mind giving credit to God, for the very life we enjoy!!!

I sincerely believe, that when people see how little it is, that they truly “control”, it is of a power to drop most to their knees!!! It scares the average person to their core, to realise the helplessness that each of us truly labors under, when we tout ourselves so highly, unthinkingly!!

Then when you see, as I have, the indomitable courage of the aged to face life on it’s own terms as the end come rushing toward them, it is the most humbling thing to endure as you witness it.

The posturing of the politicians, and the power that people ascribe to them, to control their existence is laughable. When you KNOW the truth about life. The atheists have, by and large, bestowed the fealty that you and I feel toward God, to men, politics, and themselves. It would be sad, if it wasn’t so futile and empty, becuase of it’s predictable futility.

Politics is the new religion of the twenty first century. It’s too bad that it is already showing itself threadbare and worn, as the politics through the ages, have shown them selves to be.

CLUE; the oldest continuous writings we have, are found in the Bible and almost EVERYBODY misses the point!!!

This is the story of human kind!! NOT how it was formed. NOT who God is. NOT what God wants!! BUT, the stories of HUMAN BEINGS and how they interacted with each other, and the things they SHOULD have learned about God, and didn’t, along the way. The stories always have a human protagonist don’t they? There’s a reason for that, the POINT, is how the HUMAN responded, NOT God!! God is consistant, even predictable, while through out the Bible man is not!! All the variables, the foibles, the frailty, the dishonesty, the thieving, murderous nature of us all, is exposed for all to see, and people concentrate on God when they ought to be examining themselves!! THAT is the point!! Self examinination and THEN, apply the lessons learned in the BOOK!

So, all in all, that is why we don’t see it, till we look back!!

T

As you can see there is some stuff here to think about that is of a personal nature for us all, as I said choose wisely!!

Rev. Bruce…………………………………….Tawodi

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A KNOTTY PROBLEM IN THE CONTEMPORARY CHURCH

Posted by tawodi on August 26, 2007


This question was asked of me and others on a different forum  by a minister who is considering taking training to be a military Chaplain. When he found out that the place he is going to take his training at is very liberal in it’s approach to the issue of homosexuals in ministry. I Answered as follows.  Many have seen this answer and have taken comfort from it, as well as some who have disagreed with it,  but,  those who disagreed stated that they saw it as one of the most considered replies that they had seen concerning this issue. That may be true,all I can say is  these are my feelings.  Where my family and I worship our Church has stood by the precept that homosexuals cannot engage in the practice of their prediliction, if they are in the clergy. If they become active in a relationship, or do not remain celibate, they must leave their ministry.

The pressure of the liberal elements of the hierarchy is tremendous and you can rest assured, that this stand will eventually fail.

Same sex marriages being legal in Massachusetts now almost gaurantees this will probably be overturned during the next world conference session in 2008.
It was incredibly close in 2004.

The proscriptions against sexual iniquity in scripture were to preclude the abuse of the helpless or the weak in relations of potential power based sexual encounters, as well as the simple degradation of human beings as objects, to be used to slake your thirst then once they had fullfilled their purpose to be discarded much like a used kleenex. A crappy way to treat any human being but unfortunately all too common.

The sexual slavery practiced by the Romans that St. Paul preaches against in the Roman letter to the congregation in Rome, is the stand out case in point if you are speaking of homosexual behaviour.

A personal stance in todays world supposedly must consider the “newly revealed research of the present” which you will note, I place in quotation marks.

As clergy the consideration is two fold,  personal,  and then the position of servant leadership that a minister must fulfill. Also to be considered,  is the role of the minister in authority,  as one in the line of apostolic succession and the discipline, which must in conscience be maintained, for the integrity of the church.

Now,  we must consider what it is we are being asked to do. In my opinion it is to be,  simply put,  Christians.  It is not for us to condone this behaviour,  due to scriptural proscription,  but we must not condemn out of hand those who are so inclined. We as human beings are all with fault, we all are broken in some way. Homosexuals are simply broken in a different way than I am, or you are.

This position has been reached after years of deep unrest and thought on my part and should in no way be considered to be an official position of anybodies church, but the result of soul searching and consideration of the human condition.

I support the position of the church at present, but will not, if the ministry is allowed to be degraded further due to scriptural caveats and directives being disobeyed.

As for those NOT in ministry, my feelings are best stated as follows,  what ever problems God has with homosexuals is between He and they, not they and I.

They are,  and will continue to be,  welcome in my church to worship,  as long as their deportment is commensurate with decorous behaviour.  Which, by the way,  I would demand of heterosexual couples also.  We must consider also,  who directed them to worship,  perhaps God?
No living human being has the answer to that one, least of all me.

I hope this will help you, Be well sister and best wishes to your husband and may he be found worthy. Rev. Bruce Holzrichter………Tawodi 

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