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SOCRATES, PLATO, ARISTOTLE, ROUSEAU AND…. MORALTITY

Posted by tawodi on March 25, 2012


For years I, and others, have argued that morality and more importantly, Conscience, are inextricably interlinked. In these arguments we are told that secular humanism can supply the same morals that religion does….which I and others agree with….to a degree.

In really delving into the ramifications of all these arguments though, I have always felt the pieces missing to the debate and have been unable to quantify just why.

A few months ago I stumbled on something and it is this.

Why not, as is so often done, turn their arguments back upon those who do the same to us….with such telling results, in some circumstances.

I continued to consider this and came to the conclusion that I just wanted T i t for tat, and that is no argument what-so-ever. It is specious sophistry at the very best.

Sophistry…. !!WHAM!!…. Holy Hannah!! that’s IT!

Sophistry comes from the NAME, Sophocles, another great Philosopher, do the research and then refute it using their own presentations.

How to do that honestly….honesty being of paramount importance in any debate, or argument, as the logical fallacies that are perhaps introduced by yourself, will utterly defeat your own presentation.

So first, let us begin with,

SOCRATES; He posited that the knowledge of right and wrong, is what makes us accountable for our actions. conversely, he posits that moral faults are the consequence of ignorance of the “Good”.

PLATO; Also subscribed to this as well, in as much as he surmised that whoever knows the “good”…. will do it!

This is, pointedly, the projection of their own goodness onto humanity in general, and palpably, factually and provably, FALSE.

ARISTOTLE; He posited that morality could not stem from this and pointed to another analysis in his refutation their premise and and gave his own presentation of this logical fallacy.

Aristotelian Philosophy being some what more logical in presentation, and fact, does come closer to the mark, in that he posited that this was, by simple observation, wrong As those so instructed still chose to do wrong!

He surmised that there were four basic divisions of morality and they were constructed as follows. Virtuous, restrained….unrestrained and vicious….in descending order.

VIRTUOUS; Those who do good spontaneously and happily.

RESTRAINED; Those who do good, but only after much huffing and puffing, strutting and posing. In short, internal argument with their conscience.

UNRESTRAINED; These are the ones who know what they should do but give in to their passions and weakness and do wrong, with very little conscious conflict.

VICIOUS; Those who, when confronted with a choice, will do evil with absolutely no internal conflict with conscience, felt or even experienced!

His presentation of these four “groups,” broken down as it is, and then condensed to two categories, lays itself open to defeat seriatum, because any argument from the general to the specific, fails because there are ALWAYS exceptions to the general presentation. which leads to defeat seriatum…(in detail)

Now let us examine this further.

In his presentation we can see the progression of the classes with this simple example.

Your mother calls down to you and asks you to bring her, her purse. It is to be found on the kitchen counter and her wallet is beside it. You put the wallet in it and bring it to her.
VIRTUOUS; He will go and bring her the purse with no second thoughts.

RESTRAINED; He will see the wallet and know it has money in it looks inside and, the conflict begins! How much can he get away with? Any? Some? ALL!? And around, and around, he goes until finally…. he puts the money back, puts the wallet in the purse and brings it to her.

UNRESTRAINED; the same argument ocures as above BUT! He decides to take a dollar as he surmises she will never miss just a buck for Pete’s sake! obviously consumed by his weakness and passions for personal gain at whomever’s expense.

VICIOUS; Goes gets the purse,sees the wallet, empties it throws the wallet in the garbage grinder waits a moment and brings her the purse…. wallet? WHAT wallet mom? No internal conflict here! Nope, nu uh, none!

AND NOW TA DA!!; We have good old…..

ROUSEAU; He’s the one who came up with the good old “Bon Suavage”. In this treatise he posits that it is only by association in, and with, society in general we lose our sense of “goodness”

Not to put too fine a point on it, but this is self contradictory, as it belies the FACT that it is that same society that GIVES us religion and morality concepts of the day, and time, and culture we live in!! Talk about a logical fallacy!!

When Capt. Cook was EATEN in Hawaii was that the example of Le Bon Suavage?

When James Town was wiped out, OR The people on Roanoke disappeared, another example of Le Bon Suavage? Dearborn in Illinois, Another?

Well THIS could be given as the evolutionary bon sauvage but certainly NOT the religious example of conscience.

Now let us move into the area of Religious morals and secular, humanistic moral relativism.

In religious morals, some things are always good and some things are always wrong. It is in life that the application becomes difficult, as then we have to deal with realities and the consequence to others feelings, actions, reception of our choices, and the consequences to them if what we, or they, did was illegal and now they, or us, may have to face punishment.

It is important to note here, that so far, I have not used the word “sin” or “sinful”. In my mind they are, rightfully, able to be juxtaposed, one with another at any time. I don’t like to use the word “sin” as it is a “trigger word” to many and especially Atheists…or Humanists and they stop listening, or thinking, when they hear them. For which, really, they can’t be blamed. The same way the religious react when we are called, superstitious congenital idiots!

Kinda self defeating, trying to communicate with people that way… ain’t it!?

LAW…Secular Humanism and Moral Relativism ;

Secular Humanism assumes that human beings can, with no guidance from any supreme being, create laws that will guide us the same way.

They also assume that these self same “laws” will form the “New Human Conscience” for the future. They then tell us in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS THEY WILL BROOK NO OBJECTIONS TO THIS…. “TRUTH”……You can not legislate morals!!!

WHAT DID YOU JUST SAY!?!

BZZZZ…BZZZZ…..BZZZZTTT LOGICAL FALLACY… LOGICAL FALLACY…. LOGICAL FALLACY!!

If morals can not be legislated, then just what the hell are you doing????

Can you legislate a conscience? Can you legislate right and wrong feelings? Can you legislate things that are free of black and white and apply this morality where none ever have attempted to be so arrogant?? Or… been successful at before in all of human history?

In your world of “moral relativism” we know damned well what the results are! We see them every flipping day! Children murdered by their parents and others and given a pass, sometimes set free, Why? Because they, (the murderers) were found not responsible. People being murdered in our streets and those responsible are made victims, because their mom’s took away their tinker toys when they were twelve, or some other such… CRAP!

Or the ones who chop up their families with an axe and they have the excuse that they were abused! THIS is what moral relativism brings us, all this and more.

Because people are no longer struggling with their conscience…. THEY DON’T HAVE ONE!! It has been nearly legislated away….Why?…. Well ya see… it’s like this, cultural relativism teaches us that in our culture others may find our beliefs wrong…and that is so…but then we are to take into account those people in our laws and then try and craft a society from the result? GOOD LUCK! HOW’S THAT WORKIN’ FOR YA SO FAR?

O.K.  Since we have been the single most successful nation to ever grace the earth and are the ones that are always counted on to bring succor to the suffering, freedom to the oppressed, and all those other things that have been  demanded of us by the Europeans, and others, when, and where, did we become so frigging EVIL!!

I would suggest to you it began in the early sixties when the intelligentsia finally gave custody of the asylums, schools and other institutions, over to the insane…or at least the young, with skulls full of mush, who didn’t KNOW didlly squat and because they hit people in their liberal guilt, they were successful in doing so!

So inform us please, Oh Great Ones, just WHAT are we to replace a well formed fully functioning and well integrated conscience…. WITH!

Because here’s the rub…where does conscience come from? Are you going to tell me it just evolved? Well then where did it devolve.. to… in just the last thirty five years!? I mean come ON…if it evolved, then we took millions of years to do so…right? Or as we see now, some in their desparation to remove belief in some supreme being are running shows AD NAUSEUM ALL OVER TELEVISION THAT [I]ALIENS Are responsible for all our gains as human beings and our “legends of Gods”.

I see this as being more desperate than a horni sailor after closing time in a bar! You expect to bring this as your argument now!?! O.K. give it a shot….you will probably be just as successful as you have been trying to eradicate religion in the past.

Your offerings and arguments have fallen far short of the mark….just sayin’

Be well friends…..Rev. Bruce…………………………..Tawodi

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Answer to A question

Posted by tawodi on August 17, 2008


O.K.;

What appears here is exactly what I believe.

The word “logos” is an unfortunate choice by the early Greek translators of the Bible.

Jesus was and is, ‘The light and the way.” No question about it!!

He was there at the creation of the world, and with God, approved everything that was created.

Later His mission was to assume the form we know Him as, Jeshua ( Jesus ) Massiach (the Christ) The annointed One. King of kings, Lord of ALL!!!

Conceived in the womb of Marriam. By the pure act of God, as manifested in the Holy Spirit.

Since God created EVERYTHING in the Universe, including that universe!! How can Jesus, His Son, be anything but created??

Sent to us as Saviour,convicted during an illegal trial in and by the Sanhedrin, turned over to the Romans, scourged, reviled, crucified and died.

He riegns now, at the right hand of God, in heaven. All that God gives Him to rule. in Heaven and earth.

The Holy Spirit is one of God’s manifestations, given to us all as comforter, guide, and friend, to shepherd us on the path we will walk, on our way back to the Father.

It is NOT a separate entity. And! Right there is the sticking point.

I do not believe that God is three “persons”

I beleive that God, Jesus The Christ, as Son, and the Holy Spirit, that binds us ALL, are as described,in Scripture,and, by the very words of Christ Himself.

What this means is simply that all of God’s creation is bound to Him, you, me, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, EVERYTHING!! Every last sub atomic particle in the entire universe!! It can be no other way. Our book tells us, God is in everything, and everything belongs to God.

Ipso facto; Jesus is The Son of God and told us, “Yea, verily, these things that I do, could I do them if the Father was not in me, and I in Him? Yea, verily, I tell you, all these things and more, shall you do also!!

Believe and you shall become. The most devout people I have ever known, do not accept that Jesus meant what he said!! YOU, are a child of God!! YOU, have no idea, the power you wield!!

Why do you think I am always so careful in describing these things?? Why do you think I am so insistant on them?? I have seen them work!! That’s why!!

If you take into your heart, all that they told you about your place in this universe, the most powerful forces are at your command, the power of creation?? It’s YOURS!! Doubt me?/ The Eiffel Tower started with just a thought, didn’t it?? All did, everything you see on this planet did, that was built by man. And, that will pale by comparison if we could just believe as we were told!! Almost all are crippled in their lives by refusing to believe it, their prayer is crippled, their concepts of self are crippled. EXAMPLE; God did NOT put you here to be miserable!! But, in some strange way most think it is our lot, to be miserable, don’t they.

It’s not true. What did Jesus say??? “I came, so that you could have life, and have it more abundantly!!” You have read it, why don’t you believe it??!!??

All these things, are promises made to us, at the cost of His life, don’t you think He meant them?

I will stop now, I could go on for DAYS! This is Sunday after all Smile

But I am sure you get my drift. As always, this is what I believe, you don’t have to.

Think, Speak, do, and become, that highest vision of yourself that you would be, in service to God.

Be well friend……….Bruce

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Question about a tragedy faced by a chaplain friend

Posted by tawodi on July 25, 2008


A short while ago I answered a question posed by a chaplain friend of mine. A man in his comunity had killed his family and himself and this friend had to assist police fire ambulance personell and the families involved. This was part of my answer to him.

 

What do we tell people when some thing horrible happens and what Gods role is, in allowing evil to exist?

 

C.J.;

As clergy we have a responsibility to teach the flock, we are, after all, supposed to be shepherds.

Whirledpeas is right when she says the “Sky Daddy” approach is wrong. But it makes a certain amount of sense when we consider that we constantly tell people that God has a plan, God knows all, God is in the details. Well in many ways He is, but those self same details are the ones, we as a species, are given responsibility for!!

The three Abrahamic faiths are instructed to raise their children responsibly. Do we?? Watch television tonight and answer the question then.
Listen to the heavy metal, with all of it’s symbols of death and, answer the question.
Listen to hip hop with all the Ho’s and beatches and the gangbangers and look at the kids with their pants at half mast, “jailin'” that’s what that is called, you know, when they take your belt and shoe laces away from you in the slammer so you don’t snuff yourself, after being arrested……yeah, that’s the signifigance of the pants at half mast. I see this garbage, here in the preppy capitol of the world, on the high school kids and it’s just soooo cool!! NOT!!! I could go on and on, but what is the point, as soon as this gets read there will be those who call me an idiot for interpreting it this way.

Do you, any of you, out there, have any idea how many families I have consoled after their kids have been killed in cars?? Or overdosed on, of all things, horse tranquillizers!! How many after their kids have been arrested for assault, or even murder?? How many after they have been hospitalised for the same reasons?? Or, to accompany a set of parents on the way to the morgue to view remains of their kid, or worse, kids plural.

GEE T!! Where are you going with all this, that is not what we asked!!

Oh…..isn’t it??

Well, lets see, you want to do what ever you please and when there is a consequence, then “Sky Daddy’s supposed to save your sorry butt…..I don’t think so. Read the book, if you don’t listen, you pay the piper, it’s just that nasty, but just that simple.

And then we come to the part where the good people have something terrible happen to them, and every one turns and says….SEE T you’re wrong!! Good people suffer too and it’s not supposed to be that way!!! Once again, read the book where does it say that???

We are told time, after time, that the slings and arrows of this world will befall even the righteous, but that we will be seen through it, we will be given the strength and grace to weather the storm and indeed we are, when we trust in the Lord. Does it still hurt?? You’d better believe it does, we are after all human too, but grace goes a long way to carrying us through. Fellowship of our congregations is also a powerfull tool, family and all of the support networks that exist in a church and nurturing family setting, carry us as well.

Use these things, they are real and, they work!!

I won’t cover prayer here but it IS effective when you know how to use it, see “crippled prayer” in the different thinking thread.

One other thing that is a creeping horror to be avoided.

When children are exposed to tragedy, they are very often told something incredibly stupid, like God needed another star in His sky, or was lonely in heaven and needed your dad. Well!!! Why didn’t he turn on a light and leave my daddy alone!!! Why did He kill my dad if He was lonely!!! He could have visited!!!

Do you see the damage done by these platitudes?? Always tell a child the truth….what is the truth??? People die, sometimes for no good reason and we have to continue on, with the support of God, our friends, family and others, to get through it, to the other side. We WILL be healthy again, but for now, and for some time, it will hurt and then, we will start to feel better, a little at a time. And, I will hold you and you can hold me, ’cause I hurt too.

I know as a Pastor, there have been too many times to count, where I said nothing, as there was nothing to say, and just reached out and held someone for awhile and have been told many, many times that, that was what they needed, not empty words, that at the time, they couldn’t believe anyway.
Now the answer IS in there, but you will have to dig for it. It’s not too deep, it is in the many things I have described and still comes down to the simplicity of being human and the overwhelming complexity of …….being human.

No one man has all the answers, we, even clergy, just sometimes must muddle through, but these are the things I have learned.

C.J.’s response;

Yep, thanks Bruce. If I would not have seen some frustration in your post I would worry about you brother! You speak from conviction and experience. Innocent death always hurts and scars. Sometimes it makes me so angry I have to walk away before speaking and allow myself time to calm down. How can we blame GOD for something man does while removed from Him? The opportunity of “Free Will” is a wonderful thing as well as a horrible thing. I’ve found the best words to say in this situation are nothing. Being there, standing by ones side, simple touch holds more sincerity than speech. Unless you have actually experienced what a person is experiencing you can’t understand, but you can be there for them.

How can GOD let this happen? Because he promised. He promised Free Will.

Immediately after some one asked C.J. what he meant, What follows is my response.

What C.J. means is this, the gift of free will comes with a price,

Simply put, it is a non interference agreement with God. He will not interfere with free will, no matter how bad the decision making process involved in our actions.

When we are rolling along and everything is just peachy keen, we don’t ask for Him to do so do we? Now we might have a beautiful family, a nice little business, a lovely home, some money in the bank………..and a mistress on the side. Suddenly the wife finds out about our pecadillo and sues for divorce….the little business is no longer sufficient to meet the costs, the nice home is going to be taken from us, the kids go to the wife and we fall down on our knees and scream no! no, this is too much, it isn’t fair, what I did does not deserve this, you don’t have the right to take all this from me!!!

Oh really?? You lied for God knows how long to your wife, family and, who knows who else, about your entire existence and now when your actions have a price, you scream for God to relieve you of the burdon of your lies…..nope, not gonna happen………BUT< if you beg forgiveness and make all the restitution in your power to make, rededicate your self to the truth you abandoned, beseach your wife to forgive and to accept you back into the fold of your family, that YOU have thrown away, it just may happen.
OR it may not. She may not allow that pain and risk to re-enter her, or the childrens lives again and, you will have to learn to live with the new reality YOU created.

And now, we come to the crux of it, your new reality DOES include the forgiveness of God, go and sin no more, re-create your life in truth, and new beginnings, and live it out in that truth with a new wife and new kids and all the fulfillment that a forgiven person may expect.

Yes there was a price, and yes it was terrible to behold, and endure, but it was paid and forgiven. You go anew, you got another chance, don’t blow it!!! Too many don’t get that chance, they die in their transgressions, or because of them, and those are the ones that C.J. means when he mentions anger. Yes I get angry when reading of a foolish act, that has taken lifes blessing, the chance for renewal in Christ away from the innocent and, cursed them with an early death by some beknighted fool and now we are left to explain. And, there is no real explanation possible. So we fumble in our anger and helplessness, like any other human being pick up the remaining pieces of the survivors lives and desparately hope, to help them survive all this, heal, and live again.

You are a brother, you have felt all of these things, maybe you have not been able to articulate them, but you have felt and dealt with all of these things and I have blessed your courage and the loving support you have given your family all through it, as a man of God with great inner strength, which is so obvious, to those of us who choose to see it in you my friend. THIS is the difference that you show the world and not the cowardice of the one who destroyed himself and his family for whatever reason he had. Your brother in Christ……..Bruce

It must be stated that there were about ten others who prayed with and for all concerned that day and C.J. closed with this brief note to all of us.

Well it certainly has been a day…

Thank you. All have helped.

All Ministry comes with problems. Today it brought the reality of the human condition to this town. It bears witness to the responsibility we have with “Free Will”. As we deal with the aftermath; the hurt, the pain, for some the shame. We say our prayers, we tell our parents, our children, our husbands and wives how much we love them. We try to rest and get ready for tomorrows challenges. Myself physically, emotionally, and spiritually exhausted from the day. I will quietly shed my tears of frustration in the arms of the one who understands me so well as I pray for them, for all of us. I thank Him for allowing me to be strength for others, and for her, and her strength for me. Through Him, we are a strong team. God Bless you all…

CJ
Chaplain
Kerr ESD

I thought a long time about these exchanges and finally decided to post them here as there are some profound considerations for adults as well as children to consider and learn from the things said.

 

 

 

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A different kind of thinking?? maybe not

Posted by tawodi on March 30, 2008


TO ALL;

I am going to take a little side trip with all of you and ask that you consider what I say for just a short while, before you dismiss it. OR accept that it has some truth to offer.

We are body, mind and spirit most accept this as a description of humanity.

Body; well, this has to be accepted.

Mind; that which is capable of learning, forming opinions and capable of judgement. The ability to reason cause and effect and the probable outcomes of certain stimuli to the environment or our actions within it. I do not mean in a macro sense, but in the direct application of reason, ergo, I throw a ball at this window the probable cause of the effect of it’s breakage. Just for now accept this reasoning.

Spirit; that which animates us or directs us in all of our human pursuits. The secularists will state that there is no such thing. But your fellow scientists have had to coin the term , ego, id and superego, or sub-conscience conscience and superconscience to co-relate and reconcile the obvious three levels of conduct and their manifestation in each of us. With out this concept, of three levels of conscience, there is no making sense of any human action, for a host of reasons. I would ask that you simply follow along here for a moment if you have no psycological training, the rest of you will agree.

None of us at any given moment is really, truly, aware of just what we’re doing until we analyse the conduct of all three of the elements of Psychy, and how a given action reached it’s conclusion or indeed, what caused us to act in just this way. ALL human actions are governed by this analytical process to determine what the frack are we doing! And, moreover why!!

With these elements in place for this discussion let us now proceed.

We are created by whatever process you choose to use as the mechanism that is a fact SOMETHING caused us,there again we will make an assumption for this discussion.

That something is “the Creator” ( call him/her/it, what you will for your own purposes.)

If we change the word spirit for soul we can then make another adjustment in our thinking, a soul is something with a life of it’s own in most theologies isn’t it.

Now, to the meat of it.

Posit; Soul, on a journey of learning who and what it is, created at the instant of creation by the creater as part of Him/Her/It’s self to populate the cosmos with life in all it’s many forms. It makes choices for the purpose of learning what and who it is to better itself and become one again with God/Creator.

It knows what it wants, on a concious level we do not. We have “chosen” to forget this aspect of our makeup and there is a reason for this, which I will get into later. It is this that causes us to attempt to “raise our consciousness” to the level at which we begin to see who we are, is this phrase familiar to you?

Now let’s shake the cart up real good!

There is NO original sin I posted the other day this has been accepted by the Catholic church and the Methodist as long ago as 225 years ago and more for John Wesley and the Catholics as recently as 1965 at Vatican two.

Why haven’t any of your churchmen or women for that matter told you this????

Simple they cannot control you with the concept that YOU can have unique and special, PERSONAL relationship with God, all by your self!! YOU DO NOT NEED US!!!

Now I need to get ready for my church services, more later, cogitate on this for awhile I’ll be back later.

BE WELL ALL……………..tawodi

HI ! I’M BACK!!

I figured I’d better be! To continue I am not disparaging the “church” it is a good institution and accomplishes much that is good, and even great, about humanity.

When examined closely however it has one common failing………..it is run by human beings and as such is subject to certain common failures.

This is not to disparage as I said simply to explain that is not my purpose.

A.K. popped in to say hi and you can read what he said yourself hence this caveat.

Let me state here and now, NO-ONE is more sure of the existence of God than me, NO-ONE!! I have had many “God moments” in my life and, it was not till the age of 37 that I began to closly examine them and become aware of what they truly were.

And A.K. you’re right, there are those who will wish me dead, but I cannot sit on this any longer.

Now all of your life you have been told you are the children of God, is this not right? I would pose the question; why is that so hard to believe?

Answer; because the God you have tried to understand is not possible to understand!! At least, as it has been explained to you.

Let me digress again….you have read my postings for over a year and a half now and never seen me disparage anyone’s religion or belief system or lack of a belief system and there is a reason for that….I don’t have that right!! Each is on a path, but not as commonly thought. It is uniquely your own path and NONE but you will walk it…….That is THE PLAN!!!

The soul of each of us KNOWS what it is!! It knows what it wants and, what it wants is this….To be again with God………You read that correctly…….you ARE a literal CHILD OF GOD!! Now niether you or I can change that, it simply IS.

Taken a little further then, how can there be atheists? A soul can not KNOW what it is until it knows, what it isn’t. Consider……for every in, there is an out….for every up, there is a down…..for every is, there is an, is not…..for every here, is a there and what is in between. do you get it yet?

We are here to experience, for it is only by experience that we learn who we are and who we are not….it is only by experience that we learn WHAT we are or are not. It is this experience of being by which God is enriched, as are we, it is the way to God and, guess what, there is no pass/fail. How can there be, remember what Christ SAID when asked where is Heaven. His answer?? IT IS WITHIN YOU Have you ever once truly considered what that means???!!!???

What it means is this, you know who you are, you are part of God and He is part of you!!!

EVERYTHING you need to find God, you already have, every thing you need to be with God you already have, in fact, THERE IS NO WAY YOU CAN BE WITHOUT GOD……Except one…..you choose to be.

You have seen me write about free will many times and argued with me about it but God knows you and WILL NOT interfere with your choices to Him there is no good or bad there simply exists the is..is not. Something is either you, or it is not!! if you choose wrong(there is no wrong) choose again, remember you are building yourself, you are choosing that statement of who, and what, you ARE!! No-one else can.

Choose WISELY and if you make a mistake, remember God will forgive, He is infinite love, is indeed, love itself!!

It must be remembered I am not saying stop going to church I am saying be AWARE believe what He told you, what Jesus told you they do not lie!!

Every master who ever walked the earth has given us the same message consider it.

There is a tremendous amount of stuff here to consider, I will discuss as you question and remember also, I can not tell you what to do, only you, can Decide what is right for you.

Also consider, you are not being told to cast off the teaching of your faiths, just to consider what makes sense in the context I have, and will continue, to out line.

We have the Bible but there is much to learn from, and OF, it that you may not have been taught.

Be well all and I know you ALL go with God….Tawodi

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Information Post. General info.

Posted by tawodi on September 30, 2007


This was a morning post at my Life Religion Family blog on the wordpress platform.

We are beginning to reach out to other organizations as we become better known. The purpose of this is obvious, but the way we will do it is going to be entirely different than that which has gone before. What has to be realized is that many people have put in years or even decades of faithfull service in all kinds of ways to promote peace and have a huge personal stake in what they are doing and just how they do it. It is with this in mind that we are considering a federation kind of organization. What this means is we will communicate and co-ordinate what we do and how we affiliate with them and accomodate their approach,slant and methods, which will leave them as an intact oganization, as well as us being that . The common term would be allies but, it will, and must be, a deeper connection than that.
Alliances usually are temporary things, that work toward short term goals. One thing we are aware of and, you too must become aware of, is that this is no short term goal. I’m 61 someone will have to pick up the torch in the future from me, and others, as time goes by, that is the nature of this. This is bigger than me, you, a small group, large group, even nations.
At least that is the hope. We are relatively small yet, but have talked with people all over the world. They Live in places where the hope of peace is a distant dream and they tell us, that it seems they are never going to see a day where their children can play outside, safely, a sad thought and one that is coming to our country if we don’t get it together, educate ourselves and stop the insanity before it starts ….along with the killing. Don’t say it can’t happen here, neither could sept. eleventh 2001.

I thought that this info. could come here too, as it is pertinent to this site and how we are going to proceed.

Be well, take care…………..Rev. Bruce……………………………………..Tawodi

Posted in Christianity, faith, interfaith, Islam, Jewish, Peace, religion | Leave a Comment »

MOTHER TERESA

Posted by tawodi on August 26, 2007


I am sure that over the last several days many of you have seen the stories that have come out. The focus of these is, whether or not, she lost her faith. For those who don’t understand theology, I felt it should be explained, in that light, for those who may be somewhat dissillusioned by all of this.

The first example we should examine, is that of Jesus on the cross.

In His extremity we know that He cried out, “My God, my God why have you forsaken me!?”

This cry is exemplary of two things for us to understand, the first of which is, at that moment Jesus had assumed the sins of all human kind. It was at this moment that he was, for the first time In His existance, separated from the presence of God.

A horrifying experience of course but, once again, one for us to KNOW, in our hearts as well.

Mother Teresa knew, every day, horrors of existance we can not even concieve in the forms of, disease, poverty, starvation and, human cruelty and neglect.

The quavering of belief in these circumstances, if it did NOT occur, would be astounding. The fact that it did, is great testimony to the steadfastness of this great, humble, human being, that we, Catholic or Protestant, know as MOTHER Teresa. Indeed belief in God or the tennets of Christianity has very little to do with that understanding among all people.

The question that should be asked is how, with this question that she presents to her confidant for spiritual support, did she maintain her steadfast sense of duty and commitment to the service to those she brought comfort to and God.

Faith is the answer, faith pure and simple. People of great faith know, that in the seeming absence of God, is our greatest trial and triumph as human beings.

We realise, that to prevail in these times God MUST be present for us to succeed, or even have a chance to succeed, at all!!

Now, I have not seen anything but what you have seen on the television but, when I read the book (and I will ) I am positive this is what we will find, that in the silences of her heart she knew God and knew He was there, in her work her efforts, and her life.

How do I know this? I, like you, am a human being, and after the darkest times in my life, and I have had some pretty gloomy times, after the passing of the storm, I became aware that I NEVER would have made it with out God. I, no way, no how, had any where near the strength or fortitude or knowledge, to do so at the time. That is the plain, flat, truth of it, I can not take any credit for my success at those times, none at all. I was usually lost, frightened and alone, with no clue of what to do, or where to turn, that is the truth.

So now you have a little to chew on from two directions. How God can seem to be absent. Why He would choose to seem that way, and perhaps understand how Jesus Himself could have thought the same thing……..Being forsaken.

Be well all, take heart……Tawodi…out

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